Episode 130: Donks on Donking

10 thoughts on “Episode 130: Donks on Donking”

1. I guess this is where being a senior citizen has its good points. I often ask dealer to clarify each situation or call because of my lack of vision and hearing. The far end of the table gets so frustrated that they begin to make every call very clear for my benefit. I, and like many of my senior comrades smile under my breath, knowing that this induces tells. And we keep going on with the blind and deaf pony show.

   But really though, hero has to take the blame for villain to confuse him. Had he developed a sharp eye to see whats going on at all times he would not be in that situation. Its only an angle if it gets by you. But that takes years of experience.

2. Great podcast – first one I’ve listened to in real time now I’ve caught up.

   Interesting live situation – I had no idea the string-raise rule wasn’t universal. Here in the East of Slovakia the oldest poker clubs are about 6 years old, so the only rules they have anywhere are the TDA ones which they apply to cash as well.

   I might play back in England this summer so I’ll make sure to find out in advance about any special house rules places might have.

   • I think that, by now, some form of the string-raise rule is close to universal in public cardrooms. The way it’s interpreted, though, varies place to place, partly because there are different interpretations of situations such as the one from the show, and partly because there are things like betting lines that tend to affect how bets in general are interpreted.

     Thanks as always for the comment!

   • What kind of games can one expect to find in eastern Slovakia (and where)?

     • Gareth – Mostly NLHE, one club occasionally spreads PLO. For pretty low stakes by western standards – for scaling purposes minimum wage is 2 euros per hour, national average wage is 800 euros per month. Poker is popular, my town has 250K residents and maybe 100 people are playing live poker on any given night including mid week.

       In Kosice nightly tournaments range from about 10 euro buy in to 30 euro – mostly allowing a single rebuy or add-on (usually discounted or extra chips). Usually you can also reenter once, so you can burn through 4 bullets – although that’s hard as you start really deep – 1K per 1 euro entry fee – so maybe 20K chips with the first level at 25-50. The levels are around 20 mins so it’s kind of a deepstack turbo except where nobody knows push-fold ranges or HU play. People play fast so you get close to one orbit per level. I don’t have experience elsewhere but the dealers and floor seem competent.

       The Olympic Casino where I play is the corner unit of a shopping mall with one large area for all games. The tournaments are usually about 3 tables – which helps to offset Tommy Angelo’s point about tournaments always ending in disappointment (I’m on four 1st places in 30 events plus two chops and other cashes – for similar reasons I play 45s online). The players tend to be pretty gambley – I’ve seen them take a break of a few hands to put money into slots and they also play table games in breaks. Rake is something like 11% of the prize pool but they often miss the guarantees so it’s a wash – I think they see it as a way to attract people in to play the other games rather than a profit centre in its own right. Poker players can also buy 0.5 litre of beer for 80 cents. There are some people who play it more seriously but there’s a lot of EV lying around – maybe ROI close to 100 percent is possible there. The bustouts sometimes get a 0.50-1 euro cash game going. If the Saudi university students are around then a lot of people want to play cash – in this economic environment they are the equivalent of the whales. Slovakia is said to be the only EU country with no mosque and I think they enjoy getting the chance to gamble and do other things that are impossible in their home country while they are students. Occasionally there are bands playing or dancing girls on the casino floor, which can make it difficult to hear the action in the poker game.

       There is another more “serious” poker club called the Monte Carlo that has previously hosted Pokerstars sponsored events and has no table games though there are slots hidden round a corner out of sight. They have the occasional 100 euro “high roller” which apparently attracts people who otherwise only play online. Their tournament fields have more like 50-60 entries. They also reliably have a cash game going all the time. The main game is SB and BB the same, 1-1 euro with buy in of min 50 max 500 BBs. They also have 1-2 and sometimes 2-5 NLHE or 0-2 PLO (I just looked at the website and they have 7 people registered for a 0.25-0.50 euro NLHE game starting in an hour). I’ve only played the 1-1 euro once when I was very drunk at 4am in the morning – but I thought the other players seemed very weak – e.g. some were blind straddling UTG – and I finished ahead anyway – I got the impression they were raking about 5%.

       In August when I don’t have much teaching going on my plan is play “professionally” defined by me as profiting at least 1K during the month and thereby beating the national average wage. There will be a PG&C thread for that which I plan to give the ironic name of 1M1K.

       Smaller towns tend to have one small club – I’m not familiar with them except that there is a monthly 30+30 euro tournament called the Kosice weekend where Day 1A can be played in any of 5 different clubs in people’s home towns on the Friday night, with Day 1B Kosice only on Saturday and Day 2 during the day on Sunday – so people from other towns only need to travel if they make the final day.

       The gambling tax is only 1500 euros per table per year so the clubs make sure to have enough tables to meet demand. I’ve never been in a situation where I showed up but couldn’t sit right down if there was a game running at all (i.e. during the evening or night – nothing pokerwise runs in the daytime although the venues are open). So there are also pubs which have a table in the backroom you can rent for a private game.

       Other. Clubs are members only but you can join for free when you arrive and play immediately. Poker winnings in licensed casinos are not taxed. You can speak English at the table and dealers translate the action if required.

       • Very much appreciate you taking the time to type all that out. I might be in Nove Zamky in three weeks or so, how would you suggest getting to Kosice? Looks like a 6 hour train, bus, or a 1 hour propellor plane flight. Presumably if I am there the locals will have suggestions.

         • No problem. Helpful for me too as I’ve never really sat and typed out my ideas about the games so it helps to get it straight in my head too. I was more worried I was derailing the chat from the original topic. In exactly 3 weeks I’ll won’t be around but I’ll be back before the start of August to start my 1M1K challenge. Send me a PM on twoplustwo and we can meet up when you are here. The train looks like the best option. There isn’t like a straight smooth motorway across the country yet so a bus would be less pleasant. Depends how much you like flying – I don’t much like the mechanics of being at an airport for a specific time, checking in 2 hours ahead, waiting etc. and I try to avoid it whenever I can. I don’t think you save much time if you start to work out what time you’d be looking to leave Nove Zamky to get the airport.

           In a desperate attempt to get back on topic – one style of donking that the stronger players use in the low buy-in tournaments in Kosice is the exploitative lead. Against weaker players who play fit or fold or who don’t really have a good feel for how ranges connect with boards the stronger players lead out for half pot on boards that are dry or paired and get a huge number of folds because their opponents are not going to continue enough. In some situations like that I float my whole range and try take it away on the turn – but only against the stronger players.

         • Depends on your motivation for travelling – but the Polish Poker Tour is coming to Stara Lubovna in Slovakia on 31 July. Poker is illegal in Poland so they play here, the Czech Rep, and also on a boat in the middle of the Baltic. The tournament is only a 150 euro buy-in, but I think this community of people who have to travel abroad to play might be interesting writing or journalism material. Anyway PM me on 2p2.

3. I enjoy the strategy segments when we get a mix of pure strategy and talk about ethics/card room situations. Nate makes very cogent points on these topics.

4. That’s really great strategy, i never though that before. Thank you for sharing this, your story really expand my knowledge about poker.

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